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The Feeding of the Sheep Debate

 
Introduction: This Debate was originally posted on a public theology forum, discussing the  original post, on the role of a pastor.

 

Original Post by Steven on January 3rd, 2006: Title  - The Doctrines of Cutlery

Dear Pastor,

Today’s Sunday sermon on the Art of Using Fine Cutlery was exceptional; it was exactly what my hungry mind wanted to hear. It was amazing to learn all the proper uses of silverware. I have often thought silverware was something you just simply scooped up your food with and popped it in your mouth as quickly as possible, but today’s speech has brought me to a realization of it’s greater use and purpose.

For instance, you stated that the reason silverware is often made of silver is because silver is one of the earth’s most powerful antibacterials; so, in using silver forks and such we prevent the decay and buildup of harmful bacteria, such as botchilism, salmonella, etc. You taught us useful tips and tricks for properly washing silverware; I loved your idea for cleaning our silver with water-softener and a sheet of aluminum foil, for that maximum shine. Your gracious smile and gentle approach made it easy to listen and feel comfortable. I laughed and I cried at your mastery of cutlery humor. Your gift is apparent, and has been helpful to not only me, but to my entire family and any guests who use our silverware.

Thank you for your controlled and well-planned -out sermon; it has temporarily distracted my family and I from the burden of starvation. The next time you come to speak, maybe you will bring food to put on the ends of our silver forks.

- A hungry sheep

One should pause, and consider what it is they are teaching in the name of the Lord: a man may have the best intentions in mind when it comes to teaching Biblically-based principles and may have even made sense, but if the teacher is not submitted to the Scriptures on a continual basis, he will began to take himself and his flock away from the glorious Word of God. One may set out to teach the principles of family life, or counseling, or many other pursuits but if this is not tempered with the Scriptures and the authority of Christ by the power of His words, one has simply aligned oneself with the same morals of ‘good people’ around the world; as for these people, the Bible describes their righteousness as filthy rags, as being clouds without rain, who often pervert the Word of God through abominable doctrines and their ‘good morals’.

Joshua 24:15 "And if it seem evil unto you to serve the Lord, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord."

Reply by Project Peter:

Seems that you don't think much of the church nor pastors etc because of your many critical post. Shoot... that shouldn't be a mystery I figure since it has come up in a lot of the threads you start. But nonetheless let's move on!

Why are you making this a "pastoral" issue? Why not the person sitting next to the one without? Why not you? Have you given everything extra that you have to the poor? Do you empty your excess and take care of those in need? What do your cabinets look like? Your fridge? Freezer? I think it a very valid question eh?

Reply by Steven:

I care for The Church very much, and if I criticize pastors I'd have to first criticize myself. Perhaps we should look at the log in our own eye before judging another man's ministry.

Just a helpful thought.

Reply by Owen:

Steven,

So have you removed the log in your own eye that you accuse others of?

Reply by Steven:

Owen,

We have to do more than just quote people; so, can you show me from the Scriptures what you find convicting about this thread topic?

Reply by Humbled:

I must say...I've heard this sermon before! Good post.

I agree wholeheartedly. Many pastors (who's "job" it is to do this, btw PP) preach spiritually empty or worldly entertaining sermons to "keep people awake" instead of expounding the Scriptures to help us understand and therefore feeding us to grow spiritually. I've seen this on all to many ... *clears throat* ... tv programs. It's sad anyway. I've learned so much more about God and His character from a proper understanding of the Scriptures (generally speaking - I'm not talking about doctrinal specificity) than from an entertaining Sunday morning "pop-psychology" pep talk.

This is the ear-tickling, milk-drinking problem in Christianity today.

Where's the Sunday morning BBQ's?!? Give me some spiritual MEAT!!

Man, I love exegetical preaching.

Reply by Steven:

That's exactly how I felt when I wrote it.

What really cracks me up is when people start tossing the "j" word at you, judging, when they themselves are judging me. But, most of these are just imitating a lot of what they have been taught on Sunday morning, that we should 'love' jesus but don't you dare be a Bible-beater. We should read a bit of scripture each day, but don't you dare judge.

My Bible says differently: "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17. That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works." 2 Timothy 3:16-17

These men, or pastors, can be can be equated to performers in a Magic Show, where the truth is briefly presented but then taken away with slight-of-hand. I guess this is what Paul warned about:

"For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
4. And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables." 2 Timothy 4:3-4

They will not hear sound doctrine, and that's what we see today. We see people making judgments off false doctrines or man's traditions, heaping themselves up teachers whom will say what they want to hear.

Reply by Owen:

Steven,

Hmm. What about the possibility of hypocrisy? Should I quote the verses for that?

My whole point is do you do what you say others should do and do you try to fix the problems or do you only complain.

So I still ask you, have you removed the log from your eye? It is a simply question you refuse to give an answer to. Do you help sacrifically as you say others should?

Reply by Steven:

Owen,

Any verses are better than your opinion; even Christ quoted the Scriptures to defend His arguments:

"And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?" Mark 12:24

"And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not. 39. Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me." John 5:38-39

"Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the seed of David, and out of the town of Bethlehem, where David was?" John 7:42

" He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me."

Posted by StevenC:

Isaiah 30
9 That this is a rebellious people, lying children, children that will not hear the law of the LORD:

10 Which say to the seers, See not; and to the prophets, Prophesy not unto us right things, speak unto us smooth things, prophesy deceits:

11 Get you out of the way, turn aside out of the path, cause the Holy One of Israel to cease from before us.

Reply by Steven:

StevenC,

So they do not see the truth, they do not speak for God and they love smooth speech, that is easy to the ears. Sounds like most modern-day preaching.

Great Scripture choice. Keep up the good work.

We encourage you to email the author to prove or disprove, from the Scriptures, the intent, meaning, purpose or doctrine of this piece. email Steven